Glenn Beck TCT’s ThinkProgress

As ThinkProgress notes, Glenn Beck engaged in TCT (traditional comment trawling) by highlighting a ThinkPro comment suggesting Beck was a CIA operative. I love ThinkProgress; it’s a daily read for me. I’ve never cared for their comment section, though, and this is a perfect example why. Don’t they know that Glenn Beck is far too stupid to be in the CIA? I’m just sayin’ . . .

--temperance

Stocking the Pond v. 2

Dave Neiwert posted about the cultural tone deafness of some elements in the environmental movement, and linked to Robin Solnit’s story about traveling with activists who stumble into a local country and western joint. The hippy activists asked the DJ to play reggae and basically alienated the very people with whom they needed to make alliances. I related to the post on multiple levels, in part because I’ve gone through a personal journey of originally hating country music to enthusiastically cheering at a George Strait concert. The comment thread was great – par for the course at orcinus – and some used it to comment on the cultural place of country music.

Greogory spoke for many (I assume) when he highlighted the objectionable ideological tone of some popular country and western music: “As for country music, an adverse reaction to it is often has less to do with the music than the mindless jingoism that it has come to represent. Music such as Lee Greenwood’s ‘God Bless the USA,’ for example, has done much to poison the well. It would be foolish to deny that a certain category of country music does not represent a deep strain of anti-intellectualism that has been a feature of american [sic] culture for hundreds of years. It is obvious from my music collection that I genuinely like a lot of country music but when I hear the wailing chorus of ‘Ah’m prowd to be an ‘Murkan, where at least ah know ah’m freeeee..." I just cringe.”

Anyway, I jumped in: “The centrality of country music in the creation of cultural hierarchy is actually supported by sociological research. University of Virginia sociologist Bethany Bryson applied sophisticated statistical analysis to opinion data about music likes and dislikes correlated with social class. One of her findings is that *hatred* of country music is a marker of cultural capital among the middle and upper classes.”

Enlighted Layperson asked a pretty rad question soon thereafter: “Am I the only one here so benighted as to actually like country and western?”

I wrote: "Enlightened Layperson -- I actually like C&W, even mainstream stuff that's far out-of-bounds for hip people. I'm a pretty decent two-stepper and I know several line dances. And yes, I've caught crap from my putatively cool California friends who equate line dancing with goose stepping.”

Then, KamatariSeta: “The only Country I really like is Johnny Cash, and I have plenty of admiration for Willie Nelson for some of his social work and the like, but I think we’re getting a little far from the heart of Dave’s post. . . . I’ve had experiences with rural life and rural people, and they have differed with what Jack and others has described, but I think this may be an anomaly. And yes, working with them is important, but ultimately, we may have to accept that, in some cases, we have to simply forge ahead without them.”

Then, phat shared his experiences: “Being a former so-called hipster, it's not just the environmentalists that suffer from this sort of attitude. Granted I’ve been a ‘hipster’ in an exceptionally unhip place (Lincoln, NE) at least in the eyes of the rest of the world. The coastal and bigger city liberals aren't even especially nice to the liberal allies they might have in the ‘heartland.’ I’ve experienced it firsthand. When people in places like Northampton, MA (where I lived for a while when I was younger) ask if Nebraska is ‘anywhere near California’ that point gets driven home.”

Erik explained his view point: “I couldn’t agree more with the post. My dissertation, to be defended next month, is an environmental history of loggers in the Northwest before WWII. I grew up in a logging family during the spotted owl crisis of the 80s and early 90s. Being environmentally minded, I was torn between both sides. Loggers are today (and were 100 years ago) quite environmentally minded. But they also have to make a living. They change the environment through their work, but that doesn't change their feelings toward it. . . .Also, anyone dismissing country music out of hand clearly has poor taste in music. Or maybe a closed mind. His name is Merle Haggard and you need to go listen to him. Right now.” And Haggard is an especially relevant example considering his turn against the Iraq war in 2005.

I shared one of my youthful country and western experiences: “At my Southern California high school (mid/late ‘80s) they would play the popular pop music radio station at lunch, but if the kids failed to clean up after themselves they would play the country station the following day as punishment. Serious. It happened a dozen or so time during the school year.” KamatariSeta’s “heart of Dave’s post” line and de rigeur Cash reference annoyed me, and so I couldn’t resist taking a swipe. “RE: music – 'The only Country I really like is Johnny Cash' -- Yes, Johnny Cash is the only C&W cool people are allowed to consume. Many voice the Johnny Cash exception. It’s like a law or something.”

Erik backed me up: “Temperance is right about Cash--it's all about the image. Cash is great--but those who set him apart from other country music take him totally out of context and ignore the massive amount of horrible music he put out over the years. Truth be told, only a small percentage of what Cash released is good at all, though what is good is really amazing. But because of the image, it's OK for the cool kids to like him. I think it might be a reasonable counterlaw to say that anyone who says that "The only Country I like is Johnny Cash" doesn't know very much about music. Or at least is willfully ignorant.”

KamatariSeta snapped back, “Well, if it’s any consolation, I don’t try to base what I like on genre to begin with. I’m going to like what I like, and I certainly won’t pose as liking the more ‘unhip’ forms of country just to make a political statement about how I don’t look down on rural life.”

I thought about pointing out how this comment was getting away from the heart of Dave’s post, but Dave seemed more than willing to join the country music conversation (and to knock Cash down a peg). Feeling consoled, I sailed away.

-- temperance

O’Reilly Does TCT

Bill O’Reilly engaged in a galling act of comment trawling recently, and accused Arianna Huffington of Nazism for not moderating her comment threads harder. When Nancy Reagan went into the hospital, a HuffPost commenter wrote “Like her evil husband, she has lived far too long. Here’s hoping she dies in the tub.” That’s the only example O’Reilly had to offer and, from that, he barked “don’t you think Americans should start holding people like Arianna Huffington accountable for this? . . what’s the difference between the Ku Klux Klan and Arianna Huffington? What’s the difference?”

O’Reilly’s stance was so absurd that his guest Mary Katherine Ham, managing editor of ultra-conservative Townhall.com, said, “You're going to – you’re going to make me defend Arianna Huffington!” (MediaMatters has the transcript).

In a follow-up session, O’Reilly dug in. He quoted from a letter by Israel Gopstein, a man who lost several family members in the Holocaust: “the meaning of their deaths means more than a comparison to a meaningless blog.” O’Reilly patiently explained that the Nazis used newspapers and leaflets “ to build up enormous hatred towards your family. Today we’re seeing the same thing on the net here in America, there is no difference.” Israel, you fool! Why can’t you the obvious comparison between commenters and Nazis?

This is a perfect example of comment trawling in the original Drumian sense. An individual used an anonymous blog comment to castigate the blogger. It’s a practice whose effectiveness relies on the audience’s ignorance of blogging, commenting, and moderating, which is why Ham wasn’t willing to play along despite her ideological similarities to O’Reilly. As more and more people involve themselves in internet communities this kind of comment trawling will lose its rhetorical force. More people will realize that the opinions of commenters only represent the opinions of commenters.

This blog is centered on the idea that comment trawling is a valuable practice, but I want to distinguish what I do from the kind of comment trawling that O’Reilly’s Nazi smear represents. And I don’t want to concede the term to the bad guys; I want to reclaim the term. So, I’ve decided that “traditional comment trawling” (TCT) – what O’Reilly engaged in here – should be thought of as separate from comment trawling as I practice on this blog.

-- temperance

Osama loves McCain, Hitler would watch Fox, and other fun facts

One of the conservative movement’s more odious rhetorical practices involves speculating about how our national enemies support Democratic candidates. A Fox News Interactive Poll recently asked “Who does Usama bin Laden want to be the next president?” According to the poll, 30% believe that Osama wants Obama to win. We saw a version of this last year when Deputy Secretary of State Richard L. Armitage – speaking on foreign soil – said that terrorists in Iraq “are trying to influence the election against President Bush.” Dennis “the weasel” Hastert chirped that al Qaeda, “would very much like to defeat President Bush.” Tom Cole (who once compared the privatization of social security to the Civil Rights Act) similarly declared, “If George Bush loses the election, Osama bin Laden wins the election.”

Turn around is fair play, so I want to publicize Dave Neiwert’s highly scientific survey revealing that 9 in 10 people believe that Hitler would watch Fox News as his network of choice.

Likewise, Justin Webb has a piece on the BBC News site titled Al-Qaeda's choice. He writes that Al-Qaeda “want suffering - among others and their own people alike. They would surely surmise that McCain will give them what they want. . . . I think al-Qaeda would back McCain.”

I wondered, how would this argument play in the wingnut-o-sphere?

Weasel Zippers had a fun thread on the matter. The author of the Weasel Zipper post was offended by the BBC item and criticized the BBC’s “insanely hard-left slant.” Many of the commenters agreed.

The conflation of masculinity and anti-Arab eliminationism is not uniquely American, except in the U.K. they use the word “bloody.” Rubin writes, “The Socialist within the BBC are doing their bloody best to bleed every drop of testosterone from the British Culture, and replacing it with the fluff of Homo-Sissy-Hood*. *LOL*” Downstream, keyboard commando Daddy-O tells us to “Fight! Grow balls, toughen that spine, and fight! ...I for one would rather die doing some good for myself and my children, than allowing evil to continue without resistance.” Of course, I appreciated incomplete hellhole’s post pointing out the obvious contradiction in Rubin and Daddy-O’s call to arms: “i am not sure when the land of the free and home of the brave became a country of fat wimps afraid of their own shadows, but somehow it happened. someone explain to me how the chest-thumpers of the right are apparently afraid of every shadow in their bedroom. why don't you hear liberals campaigning on fear? oh, right, because we're not afraid!”

Warpublican review posted the best comment on the thread:

“of course al Qeada wants McCain - the last Warpublican has been unwilling (or unable) to capture him for seven years - and, let's face it, Bush has been the best recruitment tool for buin laden since the State of Israel. The problem with the right wing is that they can’t keep their fear mongering straight - do the Muslims WANT to die for Islam - or not? If they really want peace, then Obama is the man - if they want their seven virgins, then McCain - and his 10,00 year occupation, wins the day...”

-- temperance

McMadness in the Hot Air

I have gone on record against gratuitous profanity, but Bob Cesca has turned swearing into an art form. He’s the funniest writer on the Huffington Post, so I was stoked when he started his Awesome Blog. Cesca trawled Hot Air after Romney bowed out of the race and pulled up some freaked out members of the conservative movement. That inspired me to revisit the thread for a little trawling of my own. I went 200 into it and marveled at all of the wacky names the HotArians had for their target, like McShame, McInsane, McAmnesty, McVain, and McTraitor. They also had ha ha names for Huckabee (Chucklebee, Huckaboob, Huckelberry, and Hucktard). Many commenters argued that we need a Republican in office to achieve victory in Iraq. For instance, taylork wrote: “I’m not about to let Barack or Hillary walk to the office and snatch victory from Iraq just when we’re on the verge of winning.” On the verge, dude! I’ve listed my other favorites below. Snark’s in red.

dkebedevilment Today is a sad day for America.

orlandocajun It is indeed a sad day for America.

nraendowment This is so depressing.

WORK949 This is indeed a dark day.

gayle It is over. Hand over our country to the enemies.

suzieviews I refuse to vote for any of the 3 Liberals.

On-my-soap-box There is nothing to show McCain will be tough on the GWOT.

kam McCain is a rat, but he will fight the bastards who inflicted 9/11 on us. No democrat will.

Bruce He will reach across the aisle and dismantle our military. He will reach across the aisle and fight capitalism. McCAIN IS A TRAITOR FOLKS.

Rohan That’s all folks. Looks like it may be time to pull a “John Galt”. (Hint - Atlas Shrugged) Gee, thanks for the hint!

katieanne It always takes something horrible happening to make people realize just how utterly inept and stupid Democrats are. She writes this, and yet 9/11 happened on GW Bush’s watch.

CS Hitlery or Obama will absolutely destroy the military. It will be in worse shape than Jimmy Carter left it. But will it be in worse shape than GW Bush has left it?

shimauma2 Funny Barry, when you used HRC for hillary, I initially mistook it for “HER ROYAL CRAPPINESS” (as “crappiness” is a less lewd word than the original “c” word I envisioned) As far as hand-wringing goes, I have two kids, on teen and one preteen, and they’re going to be forced to grow up real freaking fast in the next four years. It’s delightful that a father of three can joke so openly about what a cunt Hillary is. Yeah, I cracked your code. You’re as subtle as Rohan.

But not everyone was upset about Romney dropping. I’ll give the last word to:

NBF I too am glad this the liberal RomnestyCare is out of the race so I don’t have to keep hearing how he is somehow conservative despite his abysmal record and liberal rhetoric.

-- temperance

A Lot of TSA Employees are Thieves

That’s the overwhelming conclusion I’ve reached after reading the first 200 comments on the TSA’s “Gripes and Grins” blog thread. Was that the TSA’s intention in starting a blog? Creating a one-stop spot to destroy their public credibility? Then again, they failed to anticipate the initial public response.

The comments were lighthearted during the blog’s first few hours when only industry folk knew about it. “But then the tone changed” Al Kamen reported, “with hundreds of comments submitted, things started to get ugly, reflecting the traveling public’s fury over rules on shoes and liquids, delays, abusive screeners, and so on.” The commenters attacked and I quickly set sail to see the feeding frenzy.

The blog moderators screen out “destructive” comments, so I can only imagine what the thread would look like animal style. Commenters complained about TSA employees at nearly every airport, but Philadelphia and Miami caught the largest number of gripes. Many commenters recalled detail-rich stories about about TSA employees stealing things from their bags. It gave me a whole new thing to be paranoid about.

Here are six comments that drew my interest.

You guys are incredibly ineffective. My PEPPER SPRAY gets through on my key chain each and every single time but I've lost several hundred dollars worth of skincare items over the years since this government mandate began. realitycheck

When I travel with my son I put his middle name on the ticket instead of his first name. Someone with the same name is listed on the FBI watch list. I am a bit concerned what will happen when he turns 16 and has a picture ID. The first time we had a problem he was 4 years old and was stripped down to nothing but shorts, and socks. The guy started to ask him to remove his socks when a supervisor came up and told him to stop. I believe it was an abuse of power. . . . It is very frustrating to know that a child can be treated so badly when he is obviously not a 30 something year old man. Anonymous

Liquid gels and areosols [sic] going thru the checkpoint must be 3.4 oz. and in a quart sized plastic bag. We dont make the rule we inforce [sic] them. Why would you need more than that on a plane anyway ? Each passenger is allowed one bag. As far as the shoes rule goes Thank Richard Reid for that one. Does anyone remeber [sic] what he tried to do to innocent Americans? Anonymous

As a professional repair tech, I travel often to work on multi million dollar machines. I carry my own tools, some purchased, some custom made for me. I am not allowed to take them as carry on so they must be checked. I have yet to arrive at my destination with the full kit of tools with which I departed. The TSA Thieves open my bags and help themselves. I have filed several reports with various agencies and have yet to hear from any of them. Nice to know the government is doing what it can to keep the thieves off the streets and fully employed. Anonymous

I am a photographer who travels pretty much constantly, mostly on international flights. . . I really try to keep my gear close and protected, but since I am ALWAYS selected for random intense screening, there is that time period where I am trying my best to comply with the body search, and my bags are separated from me and out of my sight. I have learned not to report the thefts, even right after they happen. That has lead to my missing my flight, being intimidated and threatened, and of course I did not get my camera back. Ok- I have learned that losing a few things is part of doing business with the TSA. The same thing has happened to me in Africa and some parts of the middle east (Only there, if you leave a carton of marlboros in your bag, they take the cigarettes and leave the cameras alone.) Anonymous

Recently, I was with a group of military personnel serving in Iraq and Afghanistan traveling from Kuwait to Atlanta for our 2-week R&R period. I appreciate the Atlanta TSA personnel thanking us for our service when we first stepped foot on American soil. That was a fine example of Southern hospitality! However, I found it a little baffling that we had to take off our combat boots, dogtags, belts, etc. to go through a metal detector. My questions are three-fold: 1) Why would we need to go through security when we just got off a plane that departed from an airport in Kuwait with very strict security measures and customs procedures. 2) In no cases to my knowledge have terrorists been wearing US-issued military uniforms with valid military IDs, why not just let us bypass security, and 3) Having us get undressed in such a fashion while in uniform in front of other civilian passengers was a little embarrassing, and it undermines the professional demeanor that we would like to ensure the American public understands we uphold. Thanks for your time! LT Nixon

The third point was more of an argument than a question, but a good one nonetheless.

-- temperance

Good Move, Red State

Did I actually type that? Seriously, if I’m going to highlight racist comments on conservative blogs, I should give credit when conservative blogs take affirmative steps to squash racism. In his post “And Now a Word for our Commenters” Leon H. Wolf insists that he’s going to ban commenters who refer to John McCain as “Juan McCain” or something similarly offensive. He wrote, “Allow me to clue anyone who thinks these names are funny or clever in to something: racism isn’t clever or funny. If you think you’ve really zinged someone by calling them by a Latino name, that's a pretty reliable (nearly infallible, in fact) indicator that you don't like Latino people.” Well said. Right Again added in the comments “redstate is stronger for having this prohibition. Racism, sexism, and bigotry have no place in rational discussion. Commenter’s arguments are also strengthened if they can avoid the cutesy names.”

Commenters responded in various ways:

restating the reasoning behind the racist insult: “calling him 'Juan McCain' is not an insult because being hispanic is not desirable, it is because he is identifying with the best interest of illegal immigrants (who are overwhelmingly Latin) over the interests of Americans.” QueenofCups

the commenter has used the phrase, but isn’t a racist. Therefore, it’s not a racist phrase: “I have referred to John McCain that way and I am DEFINITELY NOT a racist.” Sussababy

racism always requires racist intent: “For an act to be racist requires that it be motivated by underlying racism.” mcg [On one level it’s a tautology (racism requires underlying racism) and on another level it’s just plain false.]

racism is like art, it’s all subjective: “The problem is ‘racism’ is often like art in that, absent an agreed upon definition, we are each in a position to ‘know it when we see it.’” CJNine

racism isn’t racism: “a dislike for Latino people isn’t racism” cbranstetter

concern that cracking down on some insults will cramp their style in other ways: “...and does this rule apply for anti-French stereotypes as well? Is ‘cheese eating surrender monkeys’ a racial slur now?” Vryheid

socialism socialism socialism: “The socialist/Clinton technique: you are wrong and no matter what is said, you won't be right. . . . Are we ready to go down the slippery slope of trying not to offend people or at the very least make them uncomfortable?” billevans

I belong to the targeted group and I’m not offended, therefore it’s not offensive: “Not that it matters, but I am proud to be hispanic. I take no offense at jokes about my race - in fact I happen to think racist jokes are often hilarious . . . . In my book, it's no different from someone making a lawyer joke at a party - if that doesn't hurt my feelings, why should a joke about ‘wetbacks?’” Toneman

Leon entered the comment thread to bat away some of these arguments and responses. “Look, I don’t really care whether ‘you believe’ that insulting someone by calling them a Latino name isn't racist against Latinos, or that you can't understand how that applies to the very definition you cut-and-pasted there, I have yet to hear an explanation from anyone of how it is *not* racist. And no, ‘You only think its racist because Liberals have trained you to feel that way!!11!!’ is not an explanation.” Plenty of commenters praised the policy, and the desperate defenses of racism from some of the comments underscored how far we have to go.